ISIS Must Be Stopped...
by: Les Carpenter
Rational Nation USA
Purveyor of Truth
As the irrational, barbaric, savage, and murderous ISIS continues its quest to impose the will of the prophet mohammed on everyone another rational voice is heard.
Extremism in the pursuit of evil must be suffocated wherever it dwells.
Continue reading BELOW THE FOLD.
Via: Memeorandum
Rational Nation USA
Purveyor of Truth
As the irrational, barbaric, savage, and murderous ISIS continues its quest to impose the will of the prophet mohammed on everyone another rational voice is heard.
New York Times Editorial BoardThe United States cannot go it alone in the fight against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, the extremist group known as ISIS whose ruthlessness and killing has dumbfounded and horrified the civilized world.
American airstrikes and other assistance from the United States have brought some measure of relief to religious minorities and others that ISIS has threatened. But defeating, or even substantially degrading, ISIS will require an organized, longer-term response involving a broad coalition of nations, including other Muslim countries, and addressing not only the military threat but political and religious issues.
The recent persecution of Christians and Yazidis and the murder of James Foley, an American journalist, has brought ISIS’s savagery into full view. On Thursday, Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said ISIS posed an “immediate threat” to the West, in addition to Iraq, because thousands of Europeans and other foreigners who have joined the group and have the passports to travel freely could carry the fight back to their home countries — including the United States.
Extremism in the pursuit of evil must be suffocated wherever it dwells.
Continue reading BELOW THE FOLD.
Via: Memeorandum
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Unfortunately, murdering those who do not convert to worshipping the Muslim deity is demanded in the Quran, Les. As there are also many proclamations recommending the rape of women as well.
ReplyDeleteWill the American people rally around the president in the hunt for ISIS, or will this story devolve into another partisan hissy fit?
ReplyDeleteCompeting claims:
A war-weary American public says: “No boots on the ground.” Neo-Cons demand military action.
Iraqi President al-Maliki creates a window of opportunity for ISIS by alienating his Sunni population. The Cringe Fringe blames every crisis on the president.
Al-Maliki the Malady refuses to sign a Residual Force Agreement; The Cringe Fringe claims Obama plays too much golf.
Our military says ISIS cannot be defeated without a Syrian incursion. Last year, Congress failed to reach agreement on a similar authorization.
Recently, the Grand Mufti of Egypt and the Grand Mufti of Saudi Arabia condemned ISIS as an un-Islamic and evil enterprise; meanwhile American Theo-Cons condemn Islam as a terrorist religion.
A house divided against itself cannot stand; the Cephalopods shall inherit the Earth.
In hindsight, it is fortunate the US was cautious in arming the Syrian rebel militants: ISIS was one of that group. Which puts us in the peculiar position of supporting the Syrians in THEIR fight against
ReplyDeletethat bunch. It behooves the Mideast Muslim states to provide much more than tepid lipservice in riding the area of the bloodthirsty ad hoc 'caliphate': not only does ISIS reflect poorly on those states,
it presents a real danger to their existence. IMO, we will be getting a lot of help from some unusual
places...at least I hope so.
What does Octo suggest we do, if anything?
ReplyDeleteFor starters, give serious thought to the possibility of leaving the human race and transforming yourself into another species. I did it. It's easy, painless, and a sublime experience. For a primer on the subject, see Kafka's Metamorphosis. Gregor Samsa's misfortune was in failing to embrace his "inner dung beetle."
DeleteI actually might agree with Octo. I was watching O'Reilly the other night and Colonel David Hunt (one of the saner sages on that network) reminded our "humble correspondent" that we have literally been bombing that hell hole and pre-fab country for close to a quarter of a century now and the fact that we're still talking about it....
ReplyDeleteYes dmarks, I am aware of what the quran and the cult of islam preaches having read a fair amount of it.
ReplyDeleteThe old testament is rife with violent passages as well, and yes, I have read the entire old testament. Primary difference? Jews no longer preach the violence and the extremist jihadists in the Arab world do.
Unfortunately it is the way it is and far to many (in the west) deny the power of blind faith in a false prophet.
Indeed you may be right (0)CT(0)PUS. Unfortunately for human kind the majority lack the capacity to understand, let alone change.
ReplyDeleteIt behooves the Mideast Muslim states to provide much more than tepid lipservice in riding the area of the bloodthirsty ad hoc 'caliphate': not only does ISIS reflect poorly on those states,
ReplyDeleteit presents a real danger to their existence.
BINGO BB Idaho!!! And, thank you for pointing this out yet again.
Sometimes I wonder just why in the hell anyone bothers to suggest anything. Ya see, few really want to consider anything beyond their existing paradigms. Old beliefs, indoctrinations, FOX News, and MSNBC keep things pretty much that way.
ReplyDeleteI will freely admit to my bias against ISIS, Hamas, Hezbollah, Al Qaeda, and other terrorist organizations as well as islam. I don't see that changing until the world responsible for these groups take an upfront, forthright stand against them, and take positive action to eradicate them from their midst.
Who is behind Al-Qaeda and ISIS, who financed their development? Saudi Arabia.
DeleteWhat is the state sponsored religion of Saudi Arabia? Wahhabism. Which is also the most conservative of the Islamic schools.
Lets then look at academics in poor Islamic countries, like Pakistan. You have Madrassas, which are religious training schools. In 1947 Pakistan had 189 registered Madrassas' by 2002 the number was 10,000 to 13.000 Madrassas' and they are now mostly unregistered. By 2008 the total number of Madrasses was estimated to be over 40,000...
That is one heck of a training ground for militant Islam and a great recruiting source for terrorists. The vast majority of these "schools" are funded by rich conservative oil rich gulf states.
So, here we are with our big allies in the Middle East, Saudi Arabia and Qatar (we have military bases in both countries) who are also the biggest sponsors of conservative radical Islam.
They also fund Hamas and the Iranian fund Hezbollah.
So, its OIL that funds each and everyone one of these groups that you want us to do something about...
In regards to the issue of ISIS being a threat to these conservative oil rich countries...think again. The reality is if you finance extremism then the extremists in your own country will leave and fight in foreign countries. If they come back then you know who they are....
If you really want to change the situation in the Middle East they cut the influence of oil companies within our government AND start seriously the development of alternative fuels and constantly demand increase fuel efficiencies .....
Tao, I find little to take issue with.
DeleteWe are in essence potentially financing our own demise. We have been outsmarted.
These Arabs may be many things but stupid isn't among them.
Puts global warming in a whole different context.
DeleteAssuming there is any connection, Jerry (re oil and so-called "global warming")
DeleteIt also makes exploiting Canada tar sands and other North American energy sources look more wise too.
The connection is money and power. Anything that potentially reduces oil money, affects the current power structure and must be opposed at all costs.
DeleteWhat do you suggest that will be effective?
ReplyDeleteBy the way, look at Attaturk, possibly, as example. He removed insane, imperialist theocratic Islam from Turkey and made a sane, secular country out of it. Or a state of sanity that lasted a century, anyway.
ReplyDeleteThink about it this way, people. Dick Cheney, Chris Matthews, and the Pope all think that we should be bombing them. Do you really want to be part and parcel to that motley crew?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/08/19/on-isis-pope-francis-is-no-crusader.htm
ReplyDeletel like this new Pope, and I don't think he is as much of a warhawk as you imply, Will...
Given the busy lives we lead, we do not always have time or opportunity to delve deeply into a story. All too often, we receive fragmentary news bits that result in faulty impressions.
ReplyDeleteEvents in the Mid-East offer one such example. RN calls our attention to violent passages in two sets of scripture, both the Bible and the Qur-an. Scholars interpret these passages as the recorded history of a tribal epoch; fundamentalists interpret the same passages as the word of god. There are scholars and fundamentalists in both Judeo-Christian and Islamic traditions. Point: We should not characterize either religion as inherently violent on the basis of scripture alone.
The highest religious authority of Saudi Arabia, condemned ISIS:
“Extremist and militant ideas and terrorism which spread decay on Earth, destroying human civilisation, are not in any way part of Islam, but are enemy number one of Islam, and Muslims are their first victims,” says Grand Mufti Sheik Abdulaziz Al al-Sheik.
The highest religious authority of Egypt condemns ISIS:
“An extremist and bloody group such as this poses a danger to Islam and Muslims, tarnishing its image as well as shedding blood and spreading corruption,” says Grand Mufti Shawqi Allam.
Last year, the Egyptian military overthrew the government of Mohamed Morsi and banned the Muslim Brotherhood. Years earlier, the Saudi Arabian monarchy banished al-Qaeda, which now operates in remote areas of Yemen and North Africa.
In essence, there is a wider civil war engulfing the region, a war between the Sunni and Shia branches of Islam, a war between moderate secularists versus radical fundamentalists – an ancient war almost as old as Islam itself.
Why now? Western colonial powers are partly to blame. After WWI, Britain turned rival tribal areas into artificial nation states – thus creating a recipe for future conflicts.
The overthrow of Saddam Hussein in Iraq (2003) worsened an already volatile situation: A Shia-dominated government replaced the former Sunni-dominated regime – thus beginning a cycle of ethnic conflict and civil war.
If there is one truism, it is this: As the violence of war traumatizes a population, trauma will always lead to further radicalization. Hence, the current situation.
The failed Tea Party and Occupy are now hyperpartisan tiny groups, corrupted. Octo is it time for your new "American Metamorphosis" party, with the mascot/emblem being a giant roach lying in bed?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteReferring to Octo's other Kafka comment, RN.
DeleteHow ironic! The schism between Shia and Sunnis mirrors the hyper-partisanship that divides America. You know this old catchphrase: A house divided against itself ... and all that nada dada.
DeleteThere is currently a glut of giant cockroaches on the metamorphosis market. If you are seriously interested, there is an opening for an aspiring barnacle. Do you wish to submit an application?
I'm also worried about the fact that a sustained offensive against these a-holes would only serve to strengthen Assad and that that wouldn't be optimal, either.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I get that and it isn't optimal as you point out. Even given this these bastards are coming after us, likely with a dirty nuke sooner or later if we play nice with then. ISIS and its evil is on par with Hitler and the Nazis. I'm no neo con hawk but this scom ain't no Mary Poppins either.
ReplyDeleteIf we do engage, it has to be via the Powell Doctrine (overwhelming force, clear objectives and exit strategy), though, and not via the Rumsfeld Doctrine (on the cheap, counterinsurgency, nation-building, etc.). On that, I'm sure that we both agree, yes?
DeleteActually Will I prefer the Arabs take care of resolving this threat, PERMANENTLY. But we both know that ain't gonna happen.
ReplyDeleteSo yes, if we are left with no viable option it is the Powell Doctrine I support.
I see no reason for us to be more concerned or engaged in "neutralizing" ISIS than the countries actually in the vicinity of ISIS. It is a Mideast problem and can only be solved by Mideast powers.
ReplyDeleteAs I recently heard,
"It is not my circus.
It is not my monkey."
While I agree that it isn't our circus or our monkey when viewed through rational lenses the terrorist groups, jihadists, and Islamist extremists are not rational. Sooner or later it WILL BECOME OUR CIRCUS and OUR MONKEY unless these scum are stopped.
ReplyDeleteYou have faith the "moderate" Arabs will do it. I have NONE that they will or could if they tried.
It will perhaps become your grandchildren's terror circus and genocidal monkey to contend with. Were I a religious person I would pray for them, as well as my own.
Follow the money. You don't even have to kill them. Kill the money. I may be easier to "deal" with the money suppliers than the terrorists. A terrorist without money is simply a stupid blowhard.
DeleteStop the people funding the terrorists and you stop the terrorists.
Nice thought Jerry, and I in theory agree completely. Now, get Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Iran on board with your plan and it works.
ReplyDeleteTell me, what is your educated guess on the probability of this happening? Or are you suggesting someone else may be funding the scum?
Well, RN, it is easy to blame countries (except maybe Saudi Arabia where most of the 9/11 terrorists came from), but ultimately the money probably comes from people.
DeleteThe power structure of the world is changing, but our way of dealing with it is falling behind. Our response to 9/11 is a prime example. Invasion is a 19th century solution to a 21st century problem. We need 21st century solutions.
Well not exactly Jerry. Did you read the post I recently put up on the subject of Qatar's financing link as well as Saudi Arabia?
DeleteFurther 19th century invasions were more to increase a nation's territorial empire and control over the people in foreign lands.
911 was a response to an act war war against our nation that resulted in over 3,000 dead Americans. The problem really was in the fact GWB took his focus off the terrorist issue and turned to Iraq, a very foolish and destabilizing move in the region. Saddam was bad, what replaced him is horrific.
So Jerry, what's you solution? I sure as hell do not want my grandchildren fighting and dieing by the hands of these scumbags and rodents.
I don't have a solution. I just know what we are doing does not work.
DeleteAnd who (not what) is Qatar and Saudi Arabia? Our problem is not the country. It is the people controlling it, who are not necessarily the government officials. Again, follow the money.
We'll Jerry, not much else to say.
ReplyDeleteYou might read this and reflect more this..
It is a regional/global problem and far too many refuse to acknowledge it.