tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post487303811204527840..comments2024-03-28T15:24:53.579-04:00Comments on Rational Nation USA: Humor of the Week.., or Would That be the Weak..., Hell, NevermindLes Carpenterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comBlogger54125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-87236280651875940902014-03-17T00:38:20.867-04:002014-03-17T00:38:20.867-04:00dmarks, what is "sleazy" is supporting m...dmarks, what is "sleazy" is supporting morally, ethically, socially, politically, financially, psychologically deplorable behavior. Money is not speech, dmarks. <br /><br />JMJJersey McJoneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426560061830038806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-22217351949249051562014-03-16T12:08:50.331-04:002014-03-16T12:08:50.331-04:00"As for ignoring things, I'll leave that ..."As for ignoring things, I'll leave that to you. You're so good at it, after all."<br /><br />There's no evidence of that, but feel free to make "sleazy" insults if it makes you feel good.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-81632995283619590492014-03-16T12:06:54.312-04:002014-03-16T12:06:54.312-04:00So Jersey... the Koch Brothers would be able to ad...So Jersey... the Koch Brothers would be able to advocate and spend in any way they wanted, as long as the money trail is identified?dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-34976755427905204882014-03-16T12:03:43.577-04:002014-03-16T12:03:43.577-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-85523064889272289542014-03-16T10:38:58.800-04:002014-03-16T10:38:58.800-04:00I am confused about the Jeep argument.I <a href="http://blog.chryslerllc.com/blog.do?id=1932&p=entry" rel="nofollow">am</a> <a href="http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/obama-romney-jeep-ad?utm_content=bufferc189d&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer" rel="nofollow">confused</a> about the Jeep argument.<br /><br />BB-Idahohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01388509941702241290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-17181047719381783542014-03-16T06:55:09.734-04:002014-03-16T06:55:09.734-04:00Well said, RN. I hope we can deal with this proble...Well said, RN. I hope we can deal with this problem without the mindset of Shaw (going after just one wealthy, powerful side and protecting the other simply because you agree with their views) and also without censoring films. <br /><br />"Millions after millions are being spent by uber wealthy individuals and corporations to influence the public,"<br /><br />Don't forget the destructive (and often illegal) use of taxpayer dollars by the government to advertise/promote political causes (such as controversial ads on Obamacare). And the uber-rich individuals in the media (such as New York Times) who are fine with trying to influence elections unless someone else is doing it.<br /><br />"...often on misleading or flat out false information..."<br /><br />The people should determine this, not the government. False claims by self-appointed pressure groups such as "Politifact" (which still hasn't fixed its incorrect claim about Romney and the auto jobs shipped to China) should not have the rule of law. The government should not pick sides on such differences of opinion. Agree?dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-69068012593150144302014-03-16T03:24:41.347-04:002014-03-16T03:24:41.347-04:00No. We simply need to know who is doing it.
JMJNo. We simply need to know who is doing it.<br /><br />JMJJersey McJoneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426560061830038806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-8913331413229689102014-03-16T03:14:23.863-04:002014-03-16T03:14:23.863-04:00We are all aware of who pays the money to the news...We are all aware of who pays the money to the newspaper. We see it is in the ads, we see it when we pay for it. We are NOT aware of who is pouring money into these crooked "social welfare" groups influencing our elections.<br /><br />As for ignoring things, I'll leave that to you. You're so good at it, after all.<br /><br />JMJJersey McJoneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426560061830038806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-90297161898391684972014-03-16T00:09:23.235-04:002014-03-16T00:09:23.235-04:00In a perfectly rational and sane world information...In a perfectly rational and sane world information would be presented honestly and without spin. <br /><br />Information (data) would be analyzed, various opinions would formed by individuals from the same factual information as to proper action or no action, debate would take place, a consensus arrived at, a decision made, and so forth and so on.<br /><br />Millions after millions are being spent by uber wealthy individuals and corporations to influence the public, often on misleading or flat out false information, buy politicians/ officials of our government, so their special interests prevail.<br /><br />That's the point in my mind dmarks, and of course we know we do not live on a perfectly rational and honest society.Les Carpenterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01120280762698472496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-40874240715893613552014-03-15T13:34:58.923-04:002014-03-15T13:34:58.923-04:00"In Framing a government which is to be admin..."In Framing a government which is to be administered by men over men, the great difficulty lies in this: you must first enable the government to control the governed; and in the next place oblige it to control itself." James Madison Federalist 51......."States are clumsy and inept in many ways. Thank God. But they are exceptionally good at wreaking death and destruction. Indeed, if they were not, they could not sustain themselves as states." Robert HiggsWill "take no prisoners" Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02315659209094683602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-53513097887806799662014-03-15T12:21:14.409-04:002014-03-15T12:21:14.409-04:00Jersey said: "Money changing hands is a trans...Jersey said: "Money changing hands is a transaction. Speech is speech. "<br /><br />So you would be OK silencing a newspaper by preventing money changing hands between the publisher and paper suppliers? Right?<br /><br />Sorry, Jersey, cutting off a money exchange at a certain point for the express purpose of silencing views you disagree with is "sleazy", censorship, and is disgusting as anything. It's definitely a back-door way to destroy the First Amendment, which you clearly have major problems with:<br /><br /><b>"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."</b><br /><br />What part of that don't you understand. Most if it, from the evidence here.<br /><br />Again, Jersey, if you don't like it, ignore it. Don't get your panties in such a wad.<br /><br /><b>""I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."</b><br /><br />-Evelyn Beatrice Hall (1868 – 1956)dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-43401308497265883052014-03-15T07:03:58.072-04:002014-03-15T07:03:58.072-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-52830168605032404702014-03-15T02:33:48.995-04:002014-03-15T02:33:48.995-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Will "take no prisoners" Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02315659209094683602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-7106579636438341992014-03-14T22:42:58.478-04:002014-03-14T22:42:58.478-04:00A "lost cause" to being converted to the...A "lost cause" to being converted to the idea that freedom of expression should be tightly controlled and regulated. Proudly lost to that cause, in fact.<br /><br />Sorry, Shaw, I think that lopping the head off the Bill of Rights like this is a very bad idea.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-68559286192078769192014-03-14T18:07:14.793-04:002014-03-14T18:07:14.793-04:00"The difference between dissent and lying is ..."The difference between dissent and lying is pretty much whether the person hearing/reading it likes it or not." --dmarks<br /><br />Like I said, there's no hope. Anyone who can make that statement and believe it is a lost cause.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-12929549560279930472014-03-14T10:25:32.630-04:002014-03-14T10:25:32.630-04:00Will: Those who you argue against are those that t...Will: Those who you argue against are those that think "money is life", and they tend to want greedy, fascistic overregulation, control, and theft of the people's money by the government. As opposed to a less money-obsessed set of policies which leave much more control of the people's money with the people themselves.<br /><br />Those who are " trying sponge off of others " tend to favor such destructive policies out of base emotions such as envy and greed: the government cuts down those who are good at what they do, forcibly appropriates their property, and hands it to the lazy whiners. Next thing you know, you have a Stalin in power, a leader who utters entirely untrue statements about rich and poor in order to increase the wealth and power of the most powerful.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-16069249391931360702014-03-14T07:33:15.629-04:002014-03-14T07:33:15.629-04:00A question, Jersey. If some really rich guy is pas...A question, Jersey. If some really rich guy is passionate about political causes, and wants to fund a movie with the purpose of swaying people's views on political issues, or even causing them to vote differently ("muddy our elections").... is this considered by you to be immoral and should somehow be stopped?dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-13013889825895824422014-03-14T06:42:12.558-04:002014-03-14T06:42:12.558-04:00I just don't know what your don't get abou...I just don't know what your don't get about this,Jersey. You are stretching in even more. To borrow a word you use a lot, it is sleazy to equate the right to speak out on issues of the day with pedophilia. Immoral, in fact. <br /><br />An open society does indeed have "muddy waters" of contention and different views, even if you think this expression should be strictly regulated, and are annoyed that people vote in their best interests which might no be what you want.<br /><br />If you don't like what they say, ignore it. Or say something else. Don't censor. That is definitely the most immoral thing being discussed here.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-52827381943262717542014-03-14T04:04:26.266-04:002014-03-14T04:04:26.266-04:00dmarks, the sociopathic logic of yours is now on f...dmarks, the sociopathic logic of yours is now on full display in our current election system, where now "social welfare" groups raise tax free anonymous money to say virtually anything they want to muddy our elections and trick people into voting against their best interests. It's disgusting - right down there with piddling around with children, as far as I'm concerned, so stark a moral failing even an atheist like me would call it a stark moral failing. I just don't know what you don't get about this.<br /><br />JMJJersey McJoneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426560061830038806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-83911023336481804392014-03-14T02:18:47.842-04:002014-03-14T02:18:47.842-04:00I never said that money IS life. That is a lie. I ...I never said that money IS life. That is a lie. I was only trying to point out that, instead of complaining about one's circumstance and trying sponge off of others, a person would be much, MUCH, better served by trying to improve his or her own life via hard work, educational strategies, innovation, etc.. Will "take no prisoners" Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02315659209094683602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-74037780769606737522014-03-13T22:40:17.274-04:002014-03-13T22:40:17.274-04:00BB: If you want to propose so that the Koch Brothe...BB: If you want to propose so that the Koch Brothers each can only contribute $350 a year to a campaign, I will entertain that idea.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-91474754938335837282014-03-13T22:39:10.189-04:002014-03-13T22:39:10.189-04:00There are libel / slander laws to take care of tha...There are libel / slander laws to take care of that, and I strongly support that. Opposing opinions on self-appointed watchdog websites are a very far cry from these laws.<br /><br />And yes governments are always very quick to call any dissent of any kind "promoting a lie". <br /><br />We have far more to fear from those who would censor than we do from those who say something we disagree with. <br /><br />" If you believe the two are equal, then there is no hope."<br /><br />The difference between dissent and lying is pretty much whether the person hearing/reading it likes it or not.dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-54876496319819696312014-03-13T14:20:32.654-04:002014-03-13T14:20:32.654-04:00"I strongly defend their Constitutionally pro..."I strongly defend their Constitutionally protected rights to speak out. Your fear of dissent seems quite strong."<br /><br />Do you think there's a difference between dissent and lying? Is dissent the same as deliberate lying and using one's wealth to promote a lie so that people will be misinformed and vote for your agenda? If you believe the two are equal, then there is no hope.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-71748248219331302012014-03-13T13:48:08.033-04:002014-03-13T13:48:08.033-04:00Big dollars in politics skews the playing field gr...Big dollars in politics skews the playing field greatly. For example, simply to match the Koch<br />brothers, 1,142,857 folks like me will donate $350 a year; just to be heard above the ridiculous din that is modern campaign advertising. If two individuals equals a little over a million individuals in that context, Orwell nailed it when he noted, "..but some animals are more equal than others". BB-Idahohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01388509941702241290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8549971354391868786.post-34693206163437324582014-03-13T10:13:38.067-04:002014-03-13T10:13:38.067-04:00So Jersey we could ban Kos or Townhall from spendi...So Jersey we could ban Kos or Townhall from spending money on web hosting, right? Or newspapers from spending money on ink and paper, right? Its money not speech after all...dmarkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07269773990064736457noreply@blogger.com